Glyn Johns technique

[ubermensch]

Hallo!

I've been looking into a lot of drum recording techniques recently. I remember Robin had mentioned this technique before, and I subsequently looked it up to see what the crack is.

I have to admit that the lure of using only 4 mics is tempting, as is the fact that it apparently creates a really live sounding drum recording.

Anyone used it before? Results? Mic recommendations for the overheads?

(By the way, we need to use this forum more).

[mrlizard]

Originally Posted by ubermensch

Hallo!

I've been looking into a lot of drum recording techniques recently. I remember Robin had mentioned this technique before, and I subsequently looked it up to see what the crack is.

I have to admit that the lure of using only 4 mics is tempting, as is the fact that it apparently creates a really live sounding drum recording.

Anyone used it before? Results? Mic recommendations for the overheads?

(By the way, we need to use this forum more).

These sort of recording techniques only work if you've got a great room and an amazing drummer. If the kit doesn't sound totally balanced in the room when the drummers playing its worth spot micing it as well to be on the safe side.

I've done this a few times recently and been really happy with the results.

I really like neumann KM140's as overheads, i prefer small diaphragm condensors or ribbons.

[ubermensch]

Originally Posted by mrlizard

These sort of recording techniques only work if you've got a great room and an amazing drummer. If the kit doesn't sound totally balanced in the room when the drummers playing its worth spot micing it as well to be on the safe side.

I've done this a few times recently and been really happy with the results.

I really like neumann KM140's as overheads, i prefer small diaphragm condensors or ribbons.

That's cool - why small diaphragm condensers? Everywhere else i've read have recommended large diaphragms for this technique, presumably to get more body out of the rest of the kit as it's relying on fewer mics.

If you're spot micing as well, then I guess that isn't much of an issue though.

I've read that it's easy to get a good stereo image from this method, which I'm worried about achieving with other more conventional means.

[mrlizard]

Originally Posted by ubermensch

That's cool - why small diaphragm condensers? Everywhere else i've read have recommended large diaphragms for this technique, presumably to get more body out of the rest of the kit as it's relying on fewer mics.

If you're spot micing as well, then I guess that isn't much of an issue though.

I've read that it's easy to get a good stereo image from this method, which I'm worried about achieving with other more conventional means.

because they respond better to transients, handle higher SPLS (although alot of large diaphragm condensors will handle em too) and don't colour the sound as much. Alot of large diaphragm condensors eg. TLM103, M147, U87, U47 etc. have a very pronounced presence peak so they work well as a vocal mic, but if you're after a natural drum sound you don't want to use an annoyingly bright mic. There are other disadvantages too.

There are large diaphragm condensors availiable that don't have this sort of peak such as the AKG 414 B-ULS or the transformerless TLII these work well for these applications but are still going to be quite coloured (possibly in a pleasant way, depends on the application)

Personally I'd use a large diaphragm if i needed to flatterthe sound in some way, small diaphragm if the kit sounded right in the room and i wanted accuracy and sweet top end, ribbons if i wanted to take the edge off. I'd never use anything with a presence peak on cymbals.

People often make the assumption that small diaphragm condensors have less bottom end, because they are small. it's not true. The response is usually flatter and more extended than a large diaphragm.

They also have a better off axis response which is crucial if you are recording a drum kit, if you're mic is next to the ride you don't want the snare which is off to the left sounding funny, it'll screw with your stereo image too. They are generally noisier and require more gain than large diaphragms, but that wouldn't be an issue when recording drums.

I tend to prefer omni's for a natural room sound as well.

Do whatever works for you..

p.s. where you reading this?

[ubermensch]

Originally Posted by mrlizard

because they respond better to transients, handle higher SPLS (although alot of large diaphragm condensors will handle em too) and don't colour the sound as much. Alot of large diaphragm condensors eg. TLM103, M147, U87, U47 etc. have a very pronounced presence peak so they work well as a vocal mic, but if you're after a natural drum sound you don't want to use an annoyingly bright mic. There are other disadvantages too.

There are large diaphragm condensors availiable that don't have this sort of peak such as the AKG 414 B-ULS or the transformerless TLII these work well for these applications but are still going to be quite coloured (possibly in a pleasant way, depends on the application)

Personally I'd use a large diaphragm if i needed to flatterthe sound in some way, small diaphragm if the kit sounded right in the room and i wanted accuracy and sweet top end, ribbons if i wanted to take the edge off. I'd never use anything with a presence peak on cymbals.

People often make the assumption that small diaphragm condensors have less bottom end, because they are small. it's not true. The response is usually flatter and more extended than a large diaphragm.

They also have a better off axis response which is crucial if you are recording a drum kit, if you're mic is next to the ride you don't want the snare which is off to the left sounding funny, it'll screw with your stereo image too. They are generally noisier and require more gain than large diaphragms, but that wouldn't be an issue when recording drums.

I tend to prefer omni's for a natural room sound as well.

Do whatever works for you..

p.s. where you reading this?

Cheers for the help dude, some more myths crushed - I have zero experience with recording drums, so it's really helpful.