The non-thinking that is Religion.

[LesMts]

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig

I apologise that was bad phrasing. I meant that there was talk of there being an 'evil gene' but not having studied biology i could only say its from what i have read in newspapers, seen in the news or been told by my old flatmate (who is off to Glasgow doing a PhD). I meant to say that it has been shown that there isnt an evil gene.
Im fairly certain that there is one or two journal articles about it at Dundee Uni library if you wana check? Are you a Biology graduate or have access to university online journals?

I'm a graduate in human physiology and am 11 months into my PhD in molecular and cell biology.
What I'm saying is that there is no "evil" gene but acts of aggression can be accounted for biologically. The ability to be aggressive is biologically important, after all, and is built into all of us.

Here's a good peer-reviewed paper on the general subject... http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/c...17096/PDFSTART

(it might need subscription so, if you can't access it, here's the abstract on pubmed)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...ubmed_RVDocSum

[Pubic Wig]

Originally Posted by LesMts

I'm a graduate in human physiology and am 11 months into my PhD in molecular and cell biology.
What I'm saying is that there is no "evil" gene but acts of aggression can be accounted for biologically. The ability to be aggressive is biologically important, after all, and is built into all of us.

Here's a good peer-reviewed paper on the general subject... Wiley InterScience :: Session Cookies

(it might need subscription so, if you can't access it, here's the abstract on pubmed)

The importance of stress and genetic variation in ...[Bioessays. 2007] - PubMed Result

thanks! I cant the first but i can the second. Ooooh, where are you doing it? Do you happen to know a Donald Reid or Stuart Fyffe? i think its sturat anyways....h just finished his PhD the other year, duno if he's still at Dundee though.
I agree that aggressiveness is a survival trait in all animals (including man) but wantom acts of torture and sadism?

Haha, i wont get into an argument with you, in biological matters i am definetly outclassed. But i hope my description of evil was alright?

[LesMts]

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig

thanks! I cant the first but i can the second. Ooooh, where are you doing it? Do you happen to know a Donald Reid or Stuart Fyffe? i think its sturat anyways....h just finished his PhD the other year, duno if he's still at Dundee though.
I agree that aggressiveness is a survival trait in all animals (including man) but wantom acts of torture and sadism?

Haha, i wont get into an argument with you, in biological matters i am definetly outclassed. But i hope my description of evil was alright?

Don't know them, I'm in a small lab up at Ninewells.
Torture and sadism can be found throughout the animal kingdom. Although it's a lot harder to pin down physiologically than pure aggression is, I'd suggest they're closely related (biologically speaking). For example, in social animals (such as humans) there's often a social hierarchy which is maintained through intimidation and what could be defined as downright cruelty. In other words, social animals are biologically programmed to assert their dominance over weaker members of the same society. It's not "evil", it's biology.

My point about the description of evil is that there isn't really one. Not a decent one anyway.

[Pubic Wig]

Originally Posted by LesMts

My point about the description of evil is that there isn't really one. Not a decent one anyway.

I would agree that there is no definative way to define it...but i beleive it exists.

[RiseAgainst]

Evil was a concept created many years ago to instill fear into people to make them do what was wanted by governments/religious types.

they've latched onto certain Biological traits as LesMts points out to make themselves seem more credible.

[Pubic Wig]

Originally Posted by RiseAgainst

Evil was a concept created many years ago to instill fear into people to make them do what was wanted by governments/religious types.

they've latched onto certain Biological traits as LesMts points out to make themselves seem more credible.

I duno, i'd still call mindless and unecessary cruelty in all its forms evil. Unless theres a better word for it.

A moral and philosiphical debate about what is 'good' and what is 'evil' is as endless and spiraling as the one on religion and science. I see evil in my day to day life and the world as a whole but whats to say that an other person finds my concepts of good and evil flawed. Whos right? Fuck knows! haha!
I duno...at the end of the day i try and live my life by a moral code that stems from my beliefs and i like to think it makes me a better person.

[Hecate]

Originally Posted by RiseAgainst

Evil was a concept created many years ago to instill fear into people to make them do what was wanted by governments/religious types.

they've latched onto certain Biological traits as LesMts points out to make themselves seem more credible.

Was it? But "evil" acts were perpetrated by people against other people since before a government was created surely? And whether or not people pointed the finger and called that "evil", I'm sure those acts still affected others in the same way as nowadays.

[Jeebus]

Good and evil are entirely human constructs. Everyone knows about them because they have dominated our literature and cultures for thousands of years. As someone pointed out above animals have no concept or good or evil. If aliens arrived on Earth from a planet where there was no idea of good and evil how would you try and explain it to them. They'd look at the world and how people behave and think we're taking the piss.

[Hecate]

Originally Posted by Jeebus

Good and evil are entirely human constructs. Everyone knows about them because they have dominated our literature and cultures for thousands of years. As someone pointed out above animals have no concept or good or evil. If aliens arrived on Earth from a planet where there was no idea of good and evil how would you try and explain it to them. They'd look at the world and how people behave and think we're taking the piss.

Yes I agree entirely they're human constructs, but humans have named many things, and I agree with Mark's take on things. Whether or not humans have named things as good or evil doesn't really matter, although as a species it's a very good tool for communication to have things labelled, but evil acts and good acts are present in the human existence nonetheless.

[Jeebus]

Yes, but can you give me a rigid definition of evil? One that I could apply in any time period and to any circumstances. To make it harder imagine explaining it to someone with no concept of religion. Good/evil and religion are inextricably linked. There will never be a scientific method for determining good and evil.

The wikipedia article on it is pretty interesting.

Evil - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Pubic Wig]

Originally Posted by Jeebus

There will never be a scientific method for determining good and evil.

That was my point dude.

[Thee Alex]

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig

Ok, as for the why.
Why not?

Because there is a very high chance that it's not true? That you're wasting your time? Why is the onus of proof always put on science whilst the 'believer' can say 'it's true because it is' or answer 'why not?' to the question 'Why do you believe?'

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig

I truthfuly could not tell you why I beleive.

Is that not a sign then that you should question that belief? You believe something but you don't know why? Blind faith anyone?

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig

My reasons for accepting and gaining faith are my own and deeply personal, not something i share on online forums, most of my close friends dont know as i am loath to force my beleifs onto them.

But Jesus himself commanded his follows to tell the world about him. Surely you're letting down Jesus by NOT explaining your faith to all around you? Don't you want your friends to be 'saved'?

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig

I have made a choice to accept my faith.

But you don't seem to actually know what your faith is in!

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig

By any standards i am indeed a terrible Christian and i openly condem the church for its general intolerance, dogmatic approach, closed minded veiws and contadictory stance on...well, pretty much everything.

So you are rational enough to see that the church (whichever sect) is preaching a lot of hateful rubbish.....yet you still don't question it??

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig

My faith stems from a beleif that there is far more to the world, life and the universe than we can possibly ever hope to know or understand or comprehend.

Again I have to ask 'why?'

Originally Posted by Pubic Wig